◄|
|►
Loading... (0:00)
To our faithful listeners,

We've decided to formally shutdown thesixtyone.com -- our servers will go offline at midnight, May 1st 2017.

Artist tipping and music purchases will be functional until then, so please spend any remaining credits by month's end. 
A final payment will be made to artists following the shutdown.

thesixtyone was our baby for most of our twenties. We're incredibly sorry we weren't able to keep things going in the 
right direction.

2007-2017

Thank you for being a part of it.

Farewell,

James Miao & Samuel Hsiung
Topic:

"A Music Adventure." [locked]


RadioPat
level 37
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 5:24 p.m.
I totally agree with Kosmik. While I do think time needs to be given to see if this new set up works, I think it will servce to slow down the site and casual users will get frustrated and stop using the site.

While music is the reason the site is hear and should be the main reason one comes here, the competitive stock market game aspect is what I think keeps a lot of people coming back. It's certainly what got me hooked. A few people have stated that it shouldn't be about the points, but I disagree. If it's not about the points, why have any kind of reward system? If this site just acted as an aggregate, allowing people to come search and listen to new music, it wouldn't be nearly as popular. Rewarding people for risk and the thrill that comes with discovering or just bumping a song that goes on to reach 200+ points is what gives this place the edge.

I fear this move will have a chilling effect on what music does get bumped. I imagine it will be harder to risk 40 or 50 points on a song on an unknown band than one that is well known. Slowing down the accumulation of points will only serve to frustrate new users who are hoping to level up and unlock more features.

Improving the search function in the browse section could alleviate some of the "growing pains" this move could produce. The lack of any organization to how songs are sorted makes for poor experience. Giving a listener more search options to choose from would certainly improve what gets discovered and when.

It's been suggested that older songs will benefit from this change. I'm not sure I see how this change make things any different for songs that have been posted a month or more. Certainly there are dozens, if not hundreds, of underrated and ignored songs that newer listeners will have a harder time being exposed to, but the songs that catch fire catch fire for a reason. Insisting that a song that garnered only, say, 10 bumps when it was first posted will somehow fare better now that the newest feature has been removed ignores the risk/benefit aspect of the site. I could risk the 40 points to bump that song up to 11 points, but if the song is already 30 days old, I can't expect other people to take that same risk. I won't see any benefit in any reasonable amount of time.
If an algorithm were set up that saw the bump cost reduced over the time a song is posted, then it would be a more attractive risk. Of course, the reward benefit would also have to be reduced to compensate for the depreciation of the risk, but if a song gets a second chance this way, the potential maximum bumps would probably negate any lost points.

I also agree with Willie and the need to rejig the cost/reward system as it stands now. I bumped one song earlier that cost me 49 points. It already had been bumped 49 times. I also got to first bump another song, discovering the cost was 78 points. This inflation in initial bump points is a little staggering, as the FAQ still states a "discovery" costs 50 points. This only hurts new and mid-level users, as they won't be able to afford bumping songs earlier without creating a point deficit for themselves.

Personally, I liked the way things were working. I thought the one-minute delay for bumping a song was a good idea, as it keeps fans from blindly bumping a song by their favourite band. As another poster commented, the anonymity used in introducing a new song, keeping the info secret for an hour, made listeners judge a song on its merits.

I'll stop short of asking for the return of the "newest" page, as I'm sure the move was not made with out a lot of consideration prior to the decision. I'm game to see how this change manifests itself over the next couple days. I will, however, probably bump less frequently, so that I can rebuild some of the points I lost before this change came into effect. I want to make it to level 11, darn it!

reply »


mike626
level 30
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 5:29 p.m.
At the risk of beating a dead horse, I would just like to point out that my quality of my listening experience has decreased considerably since the change. I would like to have an effortless way to listen to new uploads.

The problem I m running into is having to actively use the site to get to a track I enjoy rather than simply listening to the stream as it plays, until I have a "Wow!" moment, and pop over to the 61 window to give a bump.

reply »


CheGriffin
level 17
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 5:45 p.m.
You guys are missing the point.

1) Earning lots of points and accumulating a top-ranked reputation is something you need to earn. It's not like they changed the points/rewards system -- this just makes it more meaningful to find/bump songs and help bring them into the stream of public consciousness.

2) I believe that the original post mentioned something about "scalability." Yes, listening to new songs on the site RIGHT NOW works because most are pretty decent and there's a nice, steady stream of about 10 songs added every hour or so. But what happens when this site explodes? Are you seriously going to tell me that listening to new songs will be fun when there's 1,000 to sort every day. Didn't think so. James said there would be "growing pains," and I think we all need to remember that thesixtyone is a place for music and not a spot for its early adopters to turn into a masturbatorium. Think for the future.

reply »


missi
level 28
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 5:46 p.m.
I was okay with the previous set-up, even with it's minor annoyances. I didn't feel like it gave an unfair advantage to anyone..artists or listeners. I think though, that Kosmik's suggestion would work well in regards to the browse->newest issue, as well as address some of the previous annoyances (read: minute wait to bump).

The fact of the matter is that people are going to bump whatever they want and for various reasons, be it a genuine desire to support a certain artist, or a strategic move for points. This isn't going to change no matter how difficult it becomes to find that hot new artist/track. And for the multitude of lower leveled listeners, that hot new track is their only hope of rising to a level that will allow them the flexibility to focus more on the music and less on points. And isn't focusing on the music what t61 is all about?

What I've noticed today is not a broadening of artists being listened to, but instead a 'cycling' of artists/tracks through subscriber tickers. Personally, I found myself relying on the ticker as a means to see what I might be missing out on and I got the feeling that I wasn't the only one doing so. In my opinion, the variety of artists being listened to was greatly reduced. I don't mind digging through the site for buried 'treasures', but I don't want that to be the entirety of my experience here.

And yes, one can always hang out on the 'bumps' list, but once a track is bumped once, it is no longer there and easily found..it continues to move up in the list according to how many bumps it gets. Personally, I'm not going to scroll through 600+ pages to hunt the newer stuff down. And this raises another question: How many people are sitting there refreshing the page, hoping for a new track to show up so they can pounce on it?

While I applaud the intentions here, I think the current solution backfired in a big way. I'm all for a system that works for everyone equally. The multitude of opinions and 'fix' suggestions here attest to the desire of t61 community to get this thing going smoothly again so we can get back to feeding our music addictions.

On a side note, I have to throw in my gripe about the 3 hour between discovery/first bump rule. I had to send out a cry for help today because a song I really liked was undiscovered and I was still in cool-down. The song sat for some time with no interest and may well have gone completely unnoticed unless I managed to get back to it 3 hours later. If this song had been uploaded yesterday, it would have been seen by thousands of listeners right away and most certainly one of them, at the very least, would have discovered it. Luckily, my SOS was answered and I got to support a great tune. (And it wasn't even a great point-generator, either.)

reply »


CheGriffin
level 17
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 5:53 p.m.
So you're saying you wouldn't mind scouring through a browse:newest page that featured 1,000 songs added per day? Because that's what will invariably happen as this site grows to reach wider audiences.

This site isn't about some small group of listeners feeding their own needs. The world's a much bigger place, and I think the changes were necessary. It may be awful tasting medicine, but the patient needed it.

reply »


CheGriffin
level 17
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 5:54 p.m.
Also, I do believe that James and Sam said that they were working on some promised features that will help ease this transition. Have some faith!

reply »


mattynabib
level 39
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 5:55 p.m.
Thanks, Kosmik, for making my points even more eloquently. Obviously (based on my previous posts) I agree wholeheartedly with The Big Ray.

reply »


iyzie
level 44
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 5:56 p.m.
I suppose I'm unclear on exactly what the scalability problem is. The61 has less than 7000 songs posted to it so far. If/when the site explodes and 1000+ get posted a day, the flaws of Browse:Newest or Bumps:Lastpage will be completely buried in a sea of unpumped songs, dozens to hundreds of which will be from powerhouse groups, dozens to hundreds of which will be total unknowns. Nothing in place yesterday or today will guarantee anything about site flow or user experience in that event - it will simply have to be dealt with as it shakes out.

reply »


timyjl
level 40
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 5:56 p.m.
back to the rack for me.

reply »


CheGriffin
level 17
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 6 p.m.
Lyzie, you're exactly right. That's why I don't understand why many are making a huge fuss out of this topic. The day that the browse:newest page becomes utterly useless is inevitable. I think this change was necessary to make sure that listeners didn't entirely reliant on it. As listeners like buffyslayergirl, etc. have said, many top users on this site existed fine without even knowing about the browse:newest page.

reply »


iyzie
level 44
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 6:09 p.m.
My counterargument, CheGriffin, is that the revise system will also be useless or have its own problems that need changing when the site takes off.

And hold myself as a counterexample to buffyslayergirl. If I hadn't found Browse:Newest early and played it aggressively, I'd be nowhere near my current level. I enjoyed the hell out of it and expanded my musical horizons more in one month than I have in the last year to boot. Sure that phase will naturally change when the site grows an order of magnitude or two. Browse:Newest gave a great ride. I'm hoping that other new folks can get a wave like that to surf on.

reply »


CheGriffin
level 17
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 6:13 p.m.
And my counterargument is that they said they're not done yet. I've been an early beta user and have seen this place rapidly evolved...enough to trust that they know what they're doing.

thesixtyone is like a live organism. it's constantly evolving.

reply »


iyzie
level 44
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 6:18 p.m.
Heh! That makes makes the likes of me the equivalent of either a cold virus the site has to either become immune to a chronic condition they will per force adapt around.

I completely understand the site is evolving - and rapidly at that. They implemented this chance at 4am their time. They're probably just waking up now to find this thread at 8 pages and counting and do doubt countless e-mails of both complaint and support.

reply »


subduct
level 13
Re: "A Music Adventure." | 08 feb 08 6:22 p.m.
I'm really disappointed by this change. You've disabled a useful feature simply because some people weren't using your point system in the way you'd prefer. I think the solution is to fix the point system rather than take away the Newest section completely.

I don't have the time or inclination to spend my day scouring the site for music I've not heard before. I do have the time and inclination to stop by a couple of times a day and click around the Newest page in search of a good song I've never heard before. Regardless of how many songs come in every day and regardless of whether I have time to listen to all of them, the value in the Newest page is that I'm not listening to songs I've heard before.

If the Newest page doesn't come back, I hope you'll at least add an indicator to every track to tell me if I've played it before. For now, though, my enthusiasm for the site has been significantly diminished.

reply »


RadioPat
level 37
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 6:24 p.m.
You make a good point, CheGriffin (love the avatar btw), and I plan on waiting this out. I think you're right in saying the browse:newest page would become/is a crutch for users.
I want to see other parts of the site improved, like the search function in the browse function. Searching through page upon page of lists of songs sorted by a complex algorithm just isn't fun. If more search vectors were included, it would probably make things a little smoother. I mean, if I could search for songs that have 0-10 bumps that have been posted in the past 5 days, I'd be much happier. I can't do that yet. But I imagine that is something on the horizon.

reply »


Sunflower
level 32
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 6:27 p.m.
First, let me say you’ve got one heck of a product here. I’ve only been around for a few weeks. I travel a ton and stumbled upon you looking for something interesting on the web. A change from “Virus2” kill time game. I’m hooked. This is a great site. It’s addicting and I fell head first into the fun. I have only one question is it killing your resources to have the “New” section up? Then kill it we’ll survive. If that’s not it then WHY?

From my end of it I love it. It’s got a great learning curve and a very many lessons to learn. For example, at first I had no idea about “new”. My first discovery came from the “Rack”. So when I found it I jumped on everything listed just to get that discovery. I’m still a little too bumpy. We’ll you quickly figure out you can’t do that. Points go fast and I’ve got some tunes associated to my stats that I would not have put there had it not been for the thrill of the discovery. (ugh, lol) I’m learning to settle back into what I like. As the developers of this site you MUST know it’s just that hot jump and bump that creates the musical magical addiction to this site. It’s not the thrill of sorting through the trash to find a treasure.

There are many voices providing input on this subject. Thought you may wish to hear from one of the newer users of your great site. I’ll see how this goes, back to the discovery of the site and how to find the treasure in the trash. I'll buy into the evolution of this site and well if the changes don’t work for me well then I’m looking forward to gaining back some of the sleep I’ve lost since finding you.

reply »


golargol
level 13
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 6:36 p.m.
We should reset all the points for everybody and start over. The browse:newest was THE gameplan and the easy way to get tons of points in the less time.

BRAVO James and Sam : this site is made to discover music !

reply »


sam
level 38
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 7:08 p.m.
For those of you looking for an alternative, we've changed up The Rack so that new songs have a higher chance of play time.

reply »


missi
level 28
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 7:12 p.m.
@CheGriffin:
I doubt I'd scour through anywhere near 1000+ songs a day. I do however, like being able to see all the new tracks complete with how many comments and bumps each has all in one place rather than as soon as a track is bumped it being moved off to another page right away. I understand the site is and will continue to grow. I just think that this change eliminates one of the main attractions of it and wonder how that will affect the number of new listeners joining, not to mention the lower leveled listeners that are already here.

Maybe the improved search suggestion is the way to go. It sounds reasonable to me if we cannot manage to have browse>newest or the like.

reply »


iyzie
level 44
Re: "A Music Adventure?" | 08 feb 08 7:34 p.m.
I'll wager the Why is because they're looking for mechanics and a system that will produce the experience they wish to create. That may not correlate 1:1 to yours and mine, and every change will bring the site closer to some people's desire and farther from others'.

reply »

« back to announcements

downloading